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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 2 October 2009 01:26 am |
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I know this discussion has come up before, but please help guys. I've been eating a very healthy mostly vegan diet of 1000-1400 calories a day (I know it's too low, but I don't know what else to do.) I exercise five days a week between 1-2 hours a night, consisting of a minimum of 20 minutes intense cardio (up to a full hour) and weight lifting. Everytime I go to the gym I push myself as hard as I can possibly go. The problem is I'm losing weight so slowly, not even a pound a week sometimes. I've been dieting so long, I'm worried my metabolism is really messed up, or I have a thyroid disorder.
I'm trying very hard to get to my goal of 120lbs but at this rate I won't get there for another five years! And if the weight loss keeps slowing down it's going to stop altogether soon!
I've put my numbers into the calculators and I should be losing 1-2 pounds a week, sometimes more, but it's just not working out. Any suggestions? I'm 5'6 157lbs 23 yrs old.
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Hellrazor
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| Joined: | 6 July 2008 |
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| Posts: | 734 |
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Posted: 2 October 2009 04:43 am |
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I'm sure Nir will awnser this better but my suggestion would be up your calories to around 1500-1700 ... Do it gradually of course. How much protein are you getting???
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calotrenpamela
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| Joined: | 23 July 2009 |
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| Posts: | 12 |
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Posted: 2 October 2009 07:03 am |
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Its better if you thin down gradually because otherwise you will put back the weight easily too.
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cportwine
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 2 October 2009 08:49 pm |
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| That is pretty much my same problem. I will be interested to hear what everyone says.
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Nir
Senior Administrator
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Posted: 2 October 2009 11:36 pm |
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| Even with years of calorie-countning experience I started making mistakes with just one particular food (which I gravitated towards and it ended up dominating my food intake) and the arithmetic errors meant that when I thought I was eating X calories I was actually eating 50% more. So whilst you might like to have your thyroid etc checked out to see if there's a medical reason for being at a stand-still, it might be helpful to take a closer look at what you're eating. Are you counting calories by hand or using a program or a website? Are there any calorie-dense foods (say at least 50 calories per 100g (or 3.5lz)) which you're guestimating rather than measuring? Are you obsessed with any particular part of your diet? (a very healthy diet can be vegan, on the other hand a very unhealthy diet can also be vegan - vegan does not guarantee healthy food) - I speak as an almost vegan
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 3 October 2009 04:55 pm |
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| Nir, this never seemed so hard before, now I have to be so exact, and one small meal can undo all my work. I'm going to take your advice because I consider you the resident expert. And honestly I don't write everything down, and I want to make sure stuff isn't sneaking in. But it really seems like if I don't eat 800 or less calories a day I'm gaining or not losing.
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Hellrazor
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| Joined: | 6 July 2008 |
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| Posts: | 734 |
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Posted: 3 October 2009 06:52 pm |
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In my opinion with how much you are working out I would up it. The reason I say that is because my wife is the same as you and she works out half of what you do she still loses (1500-1700 calories). I know everyone's body is different but it can't hurt to try.Thats why I say up your intake. Look at your body like a water wheel. The more water to wheel the faster it spins the less the slower it moves.
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 4 October 2009 09:24 pm |
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| For the last week I haven't been going to the gym as much, and I'm suddenly dropping again, and I wonder if that has something to do with. I'm starting to highly suspicion that going to the gym that much is causing me to gain some good size muscle and that's why I wasn't seeing the scale drop. Either way I'm glad to report a two pound drop this week. I think I will start going to the gym five days a week again, but then do 3 days the next week so my body can repair and I can see some losses.
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r_beau
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| Joined: | 12 April 2008 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 117 |
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Posted: 6 October 2009 05:57 pm |
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I am no expert, but it sounds to me like you are not eating enough for how hard you are working out.
I would SLOWLY increase your calories to at least 1400 every day (which right now is your maximum). Chances are, your body is working so hard to keep all this energy in because it knows it needs it for those intense workouts at the gym!
I too am about 5'6" and 23 years old. This morning I weighed in at 133 pounds and I shoot for 1450 calories a day and workout 6 days a week. I alternate between HIIT cardio (usually 4 times a week) and one fat-zone cardio day and one aerobic class a week. Plus I lift pretty hard two times a week.
And I have been losing weight no problem.
I had it explained to be by a trainer this way:
Take HIIT for example. The reason you only do 20-30 minutes is because that is how long it takes to use up your initial energy and NOT tap into your fat energy reserves. Therefore, when you do your cardio workout, your body sees that it does NOT need fat in order to complete the workout (remember, you are not tapping into those fat energy reserves). So your body thinks you don't need that fat around. This is why you will BURN FAT for many hours after you do your HIIT cardio, but you will not burn fat while you are doing your HIIT cardio. This is what makes the HIIT cardio so effective. You put minimal time in at the gym for maximum results.
And since it is not good to always do the same thing everytime at the gym because your body will get used to it and the exercise will become less effective (than it was when you started), it is still a good idea to mix in the fat-burning-zone intensity workouts too. These are the workouts where you work out longer (maybe an hour) but at a mid-intensity level based on your weight, height, and level. This workout WILL burn fat during the workout because you are going to use up your initial energy reserves and need to tap into that fat energy reserve to keep working out. However, you will NOT burn fat at any other time of the day because your body knows it needs that fat in order to complete your workout at the gym. So it is going to hang onto it. So it's not really in-effective (because you still burn fat) but just a different form of exercise.
Make sense?
Also, it is important to WHAT you are eating. We all have different metabolisms but I have found that 40% carbs, 30% protein, and 30% fat is the best combo for me. You may need to figure out what works best for you. Also, I make sure I eat at LEAST 100 grams of protein per day because protein is essential for weight loss.
30% fat you may ask? Note that these are GOOD fats from nuts, seeds, oils (like flax and olive), and the like.
And the carbs are only from whole-grain sources; absolutely NO processed foods.
I also keep my SALT INTAKE to a minimum. I for sure keep it under 2000 mg? a day but I see the best results when it is only around 1000 mg a day. That's pretty low and you really have to watch your food labels if you want to do that.
And, drink lots and lots and lots of water!
Edited b/c I got off topic.... The reason I mentioned the HIIT and fat-burn cardio is because you said you do very intense cardio for UP to an hour. It is fine to do that for the 20 minutes but I wouldn't do a high intentisy cardio for 30 minutes, because of the explanation I gave. If you do want to do a long bout of cardio, do it in a fat-burning zone rather than high-intensity.
Last edited on 6 October 2009 06:08 pm by r_beau
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 6 October 2009 10:31 pm |
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| r_beau, I think you're right about the high intensity cardio. I was doing hour long sessions at my maximum, but recently I've stepped down, and I'm only doing high intensity for about 20-30 minutes and my weight is actually dropping again. I will eventually up my calories again, but I'm afraid to do it too soon. I did a re-feed a few weeks ago that helped me, but I'm afraid to do them too close together. It's been so hard for me to lose weight since I dropped below the 170's.
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Nir
Senior Administrator
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Posted: 7 October 2009 12:08 am |
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The reason one cannot work 'at maximum' for an hour, and why an HIIT workout can't be 30 minutes long is that if you're truly working at your maximum you should be spent well before that point. By definition, your maximum will not be sustainable over a long period of time.
(And the guy who won the 100m event is not able to sustain this sprint pace over the length of a marthon, funny that)
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 7 October 2009 01:43 am |
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| Nir for clarification by "my maximum" I mean walking at a big incline as fast as I can without literally falling off the treadmill (I generally do an incline of 8 walking at 4.7.) I do this for an hour without stopping or slowing down. I sweat from my head to my toes, I look like I've taken a shower after this workout. If this isn't at maximum then I don't know what is. But I do believe I'm burning a lot of calories.
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Scoobees
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 7 October 2009 03:21 am |
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I think it's just a difference in the definition of 'maximum' intensity. There's working out intensely like your workout appears to be, and HIIT which is a workout that includes short bursts/intervals of maximum all-out effort - where you are giving it your all - for periods of 15 sec to one minute - to a minute of moderate intensity; rotating these intervals for approx 20 min. The reason these workouts are so much shorter is that it's basically impossible to actually sustain such an all-out effort for much longer - if you're truly maxing out. I was sooo close to throwing up on my first HIIT on a stationary bike  .
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r_beau
New Member
| Joined: | 12 April 2008 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 117 |
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Posted: 7 October 2009 04:05 am |
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Thin girl: I would not quantify walking at 4.7 mph with an 8 incline to be "maximum intensity". Yes it is a very brisk walk and is taking plenty of energy but if it was truly maximum, as Nir pointed out, you would NOT be able to maintain it for a whole hour.
Can you run as fast as you possibly can sprint for a whole hour? Of course not.
Scobees is correct: When you correctly do HIIT you literally feel like you are going to throw up afterward because you have worked so hard. I know this to be true because it does happen to me! And for each interval, you need to work SO hard that you literally cannot take one more step. THAT'S maximum intensity.
Now I am not saying walking like you are doing is bad (any exercise is way better than no exercise!!) but it is NOT HIIT nor maximum intensity. I'd probably classify it as fat-burning cardio but it really depends on where your heart rate is landing too.
I would suggest to invest in a nice heart rate monitor. I got one for Christmas last year and I have no idea how I have worked out without it! It can give you a much better estimate of how many calories you are truly burning since the cardio machine estimates are usually WAY off 90%+ of the time, if not more. But the even bigger benefit is that you can monitor your heart rate.
For me being 23 years old and young and fit, my resting heart rate when I am sitting around is about 55 to 60 bpm. That's pretty slow. So when I do HIIT, during the high-intensity intervals I work my booty off to crank my heart rate up to at least 190 bpm but reaching for 200 bpm. THIS IS NOT EASY. And this is why you only do it for an interval of time. A 3 minute interval is the longest interval I have ever heard of. I try to change up my intervals and I can tell you that it gets very, very hard around 1.5 to 2 minutes, much less 3 minutes.
So I vary the intervals based on how much time I need to recover in-between. For example, the workout I did today on an elliptical-like machine was:
4 minutes warm up
3 minutes high
2 minutes slow walk
3 minutes high
2 minutes slow walk
3 minutes high
2 minute slow walk
3 minutes high
4 minutes cool down
Two days ago I did HIIT on a different machine and I did:
4 minutes warm up
2 minutes high
1 minute slow
2 minutes high
1 minute slow
2 minutes high
2 minutes slow
2 minutes high
1 minute slow
2 minutes high
1 minute slow
1 minute high
30 seconds slow
30 seconds high
4 minute cool down
And like I said, during those "highs" I work as hard as I can and pump my legs as fast as I can so my heart rate is up at 190-200 bpm. I varied the recovery time on that second set I posted b/c sometimes my heart rate would still not be recovered to a nice 120-130 range. The purpose of the low-intensity part is to let your heart rate come back down.
When I do my 3 minute intervals, 2 minutes is usually plenty of time to let my heart rate slow.
I have done it on a stationary bike before where I did intervals of 30 seconds HIGH (pedal as fast as my legs and go on a high resistance) and 90 seconds of recovery, over a period of 20 minutes.
Anyway, I am rambling again...
But my point is doing 8 incline at 4.7 CONSTANT for a whole hour (or 20-30 minutes) is not maximum intensity. Still a good workout I am sure, but not maximum.
Why don't you give a true HIIT a try a couple times a week, to rotate with your treadmil workout? You start out with SMALL intervals (try going for 15 seconds to start with or something, don't try a whole 3 minutes the first time!!) and gradually build yourself up. And don't do it for longer than 20 minutes (excluding warm up and cool down)
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 7 October 2009 04:03 pm |
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| Sorry if anyone was confused, but I was never doing HIIT, just really hardcore cardio that I worked out on my own, I never claimed that I was doing HIIT for an hour. Thank you r_beau for the explanation of what it is, I might want to try it sometime, although I like my workout right now.
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BJD74
Senior Member
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Posted: 7 October 2009 06:25 pm |
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I AM ALWAYS CHANGING UP MY WORKOUTS SO THAT I DONT BURN OUT OR GET BORED WITH THE SAME ROUTINE AND I LIKE TO DO THE INTERVAL WORKOUTS MUCH MORE ESP WHEN I NEED TO KICK UP A FEW MORE CALORIE BURNS.
I DONT HAVE MONEY FOR A GYM, BUT WE DO OWN A BOWFLEX AND I HAVE A MECCA OF LESLIE SANSONE WALKING VIDEOS THAT RANGE FROM 5MPH 12 MIN MILES, TO 45 MIN 3 MILES THAT USE WEIGHTS FOR THE UPPER BODY, TO 2 MILE HIGH INTERVAL ROTATIONS WHERE YOU DO A JOG FOR 2 MIN THEN 3 MIN FAST 3-4MPH WALK AND THEN GO INTO COOL DOWNS ETC.
I REALLY LOVE HER WALKS, AND AS R-BEAU SAIS, IT GETS ME PRETTY SWEATY ON THE INTERVAL ROUTINES AND ALL OF THEM RUN OVER THE 20 MIN BUT ONLY ONE GOES PAST AN HOUR BECAUSE AFTER THE 50MIN ITS ALL COOL DOWN STRETCH ANYWAY. I DONT DO ANYTHING LESS THAN 20 MIN BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO GET THERE TO START TO BURN THE FAT RESERVES.
WHEN I JUST NEED TO GET OUTSIDE, I NEVER DO MY WALK UNDER 3-5 MPH, AND I EITHER HAVE 2 DOGS TO WALK WITH ME OR MY KID IN HER OFFROAD STROLLER THAT ADDS TO MY WORKOUT TOO AND WE ARE ALWAYS OUT OVER 40MIN-1.50HRS.
SOME DAYS WHEN I DONT WANT TO DO ANY OF THAT STUFF, I WILL JOG MY LARGE LIVING ROOM FOR 30-35MIN, THAT IS AT LEAST A 4-5MPH JOG AND I DONT HAVE TO DRAG ANYONE OUT WITH ME.
I TRY TO GET A SOLID WORKOUT IN AT LEAST 5 DAYS A WEEK, AND ANYTHING ABOVE THAT IS EXTRA.
A YEAR AGO YOU COULDNT DRAG ME OUT TO GET A 30 MIN JOG IN! I HAVE DONE A LOT TO IMPROVE MY STAMINA AND LESLIE HAS BEEN IN MY LIFE FOR OVER 4 YEARS PUSHING ME ALONG TOO!! LOSING 30 PDS + HASNT HURT EITHER! :)
WE ARE ALL DIFFERENT THOUGH AND IF YOU TRY THE INTERVALS WITH HIGH AND LOW SPURTS, I BET YOU WILL FEEL A DIFFERENCE...IT REALLY DOES WORK! :) AND IT CHANGES THINGS OUT, LETS YOUR HEART COOL DOWN ETC..IT IS SO GOOD FOR YOUR BODY!
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r_beau
New Member
| Joined: | 12 April 2008 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 117 |
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Posted: 7 October 2009 09:59 pm |
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl wrote: Thank you r_beau for the explanation of what it is, I might want to try it sometime, although I like my workout right now.
Just going back to your original questions/concerns, it probably would be a good thing to try HIIT now (mixed in with your current workout) since you aren't seeing much movement on the scale anymore.
It would be something different that your body is not used to so that might be a good way to jump start the weight loss again. Whenever you "confuse" the body, that is when you are going to notice the change on the scale. If you do the same thing day in and day out, your body gets used to it, in a sense.
Just a thought.
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl
Distinguished Member
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Posted: 8 October 2009 08:12 pm |
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| r_beau, one of the reasons I was never that interested in HIIT was because I thought it involved a lot of weight lifting and I was afraid of bulking up, but from your explanation it seems like you can do it with just cardio, is that true? And when first starting out did you continue to do regular workouts with HIIT until you got used to it? I would be worried I could only do it for a few minutes, but still need more of a workout until I got used to it.
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r_beau
New Member
| Joined: | 12 April 2008 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 117 |
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Posted: 8 October 2009 09:23 pm |
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OnceUpon-A-ThinGirl wrote: r_beau, one of the reasons I was never that interested in HIIT was because I thought it involved a lot of weight lifting and I was afraid of bulking up, but from your explanation it seems like you can do it with just cardio, is that true? And when first starting out did you continue to do regular workouts with HIIT until you got used to it? I would be worried I could only do it for a few minutes, but still need more of a workout until I got used to it.
HIIT cardio has nothing to do with weight lifting! It is simply cardio.
You are probably thinking of circuit training which is a mix of cardio and strength/weight training. I can explain that too, if you are interested.
I am not sure if I understand what you mean when you ask about doing regular workouts.....
You certainly can still do your normal workout on the treadmil, say, 3 times a week. Do the HIIT 2 or 3 times a week. That leaves 1 or 2 rest days (which are important too! Your body needs to recover). Just start out with small intervals. Do something like this:
On any cardio machine -->
--start off with 4 minutes of a warmup on a low resistance
--15 seconds AS HARD AS YOU POSSIBLY CAN on a higher resistance level. I am not talking about half-@$$ing it. You need to not be able to breath when you get to the end of that 15 seconds. You should be breathing so hard that you could not squeak out one sentence or word to a person if they asked you a question. THAT is maximum intensity.
--then rest for 1 to 2 minutes or however long it takes you to recover back down to breathing and moving comfortably. DO NOT JUST STOP. It is supposed to be low-intensity to allow you to recover; not stopping. Just put the resistance back down to a low level and go slowly.
--Then do another 15 seconds AS HARD AS YOU POSSIBLY CAN on a higher resistance level.
--And again 1 to 2 minutes of slow walking, low resistance to recover
And just keep doing intervals like that for 20 minutes or so.
If 15 seconds is too easy for you, make the interval longer. Maybe go for 30 seconds as hard as you can.
Increase your high-intensity interval every week. And there's nothing wrong with mixing it up! Sometimes I do 3 minute intervals with a 2 minute recovery or sometimes I go 2 minute intervals with a 1 minute recovery. Or, every once in a while I will hop on a stationary bike and do 30 seconds high intensity with 30 seconds recovery (really hard!)
The length of the interval itself will vary. Just make sure the high-intensity interval is long enough to push yourself into a very, very high heart rate and make you feel like you can literally not take one more step.
And just make sure the recovery interval is LONG enough to let your breathing and heart rate to return to almost normal.
Like I said, you can do this on a treadmill, stationary bike, elliptical, stair stepper or any cardio machine.
However, it is important to know that if you have any medical condition that you shouldn't be pushing your heart so hard with, you need to check with your medical doctor.
As far as the weight lifting.....
Honestly I think it is a huge myth when women think they are going to bulk up like the Incredible Hulk if they pick up a barbell. Most women should not worry about bulking up because you have to be in a pretty serious and strict program to do so. For men or women, period. I myself actually lift fairly heavy (I push myself to exhaustion sets) and I am by no means "bulked up." Rather, I think I look "toned" and "fit." I think it is important for your overall health and weight loss goals to do some sort of strength training at least 2 to 3 times a week.
I have never heard of a single trainer or professional who does not recommend weekly weight lifting or strength training.
So I encourage you to be lifting weights if you are not doing so already. You will NOT bulk up. You actually will notice your clothes fitting much better. And who doesn't want that?
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BJD74
Senior Member
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Posted: 8 October 2009 11:44 pm |
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r-beau that is almost identical to the leslie walking videos that integrate jogging in with the walks which vary in intensity but my jogs run 2 min each interval (kicks, knee lifts, side leg swings and jogging with a transition to HI) and the videos consist of at least 3 sets of that.....3high 2jog 3 hard walk catching breath and then back again 2 more sets....its awesome and it works for me at home, and not near or desiring to do the gym scene. (my daughter even does it sometimes! she loves to kick!) I also use weights for upper body, and i often dont do the same routine more than 2-3x a week, meaning i alternate between my 5 videos. I also have a bowflex tension rod machine at home too, that i tend to use more in the winter when i am not outside using my muscles for strength and toning. We have 2.75 ac, 2 horses and lots of house projects so my arms and legs get a lot of work! :) i agree that we as women, and even men would really have to spend some serious time on the wts to look like a weight lifter, the tone definately comes first...that smoothness and leaner look is a wonderful result for me in regards to using the wts. I love to have the strength and the pop of muscle when i lift things, it means i am doing something right. i am in no way flabby anymore, but i am not muscle girl either... lol...it takes too much time!! i dont want hard, i want soft toned. :)
i am just sharing this because i feel good about my workout because they fall into this idea you represent, and are working well for my shape and that makes me smile. I am on the right path! :)
at this point, its funny to say that i dont ever see myself just walking normal or not doing the high intensity jog workouts, its like normal for me to integrate that in all my workouts. The other great thing about her videos is that you use your entire body in all workouts, nothing gets leftout and you get a great workout. The "workout folks" with her, have been with her as long as i have been using them, over 4 yrs and i see them always changing toning etc...sure its not overnite, but then weight loss isnt either, its a life change. :)
ok, im done...thanks for listening and explaining these workouts so well! :) you rock!
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r_beau
New Member
| Joined: | 12 April 2008 |
| Location: | Oregon USA |
| Posts: | 117 |
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Posted: 9 October 2009 03:34 am |
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BJD74: Exactly! You can pretty much do HIIT with anything --> just so long as you are getting your heart rate into the appropriate range (based on your age, weight, and fitness level).
And I too think it is important to involved the WHOLE body when working out.
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diyah
New Member
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Posted: 24 October 2009 03:16 pm |
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| Metabolism is basically how many calories that burn each day. If you want to know detail about How to make our metabolsm well you can find in smartbabysecret.com/healthy/9-the-ultimate-fat-burning-foods.html Last edited on 24 October 2009 03:39 pm by
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